Shinken integration into Nagios? Won’t be possible…
Hi,
Some days ago, we post Shinken at Nagios seedcamp, the contest for the Nagios community. But after some days, still no Shinken post available. That confirmed : it’s censored X_X
You can see at http://twitter.com/motherofnagios/status/15316282420 that Shinken is baned from seedcamp.
Ok, that’s their right, even if seedcamp is for the community :-S
I think now the road is quite clear. We never got answer for the initial Shinken proposal because we are saw as a renegade project. In fact, now we can say that we are a fork. They made us be it, so let really be it, and be proud about it.
We will keep Nagios compatibility of course, and if the whole community ask for a Nagios integration, we can merge. But now this merge is no more an objective. We won’t run after a stopping project. We will evolve faster than it does.
Let make the better IT monitoring tool. We are a Fork. We are “The next industry standard in IT Monitoring” (lets say in one year or more 
).
Jean
“The next industry standard in IT Monitoring”
Lets hope so! I hate configure Nagios in large environments!
The only somewhat accurate statement in this blog is that “seedcamp is for the community”. Its for the Nagios Community.
Nagios seedcamp is for addons and plugins for nagios, not for reimplementations of nagios.
The rest of the blog is totally ridiculous! We did not make you do anything. It’s time to put on your “man pants” and save the “drama for your mama”.
Start by reading the rules for the nagios seedcamp.
Hi,
Yes, seedcamp is for the Nagios community. And when the proposal was posted, Shinken project was still for a future inclusion into the main project.
I think the monitoring community want some new features and a powerful open source solution. That’s why I proposed this solution. It can be a technicaly bad solution, but just one anwser about this (6 months of work when the proposal was posted) is not something so hard to do.
And so you are right you did not make me do anything directly. We’ve got no news nor interdiction (maybe if someone try to make business with it we will, but I don’t hope so). But in a open source world (but are we still talking about it?) no news imply forks. That’s the rule. Even for our project that’s a possibility (and if it make it better, lets do it).
For the drama, thanks, we already eard it in the mailing list. Again this rethorical technique. But that’s not something very useful in the open source world. It’s not just the source that’s open, it’s even (and especialy) critisms (and mine was quite good in fact : lets the project be even better). Like I say in it, let stop flaming war or personal attack. That’s a nonsense (and I’m very bad at it, sorry).
I propose you do do as a classic way in the open source world (and I don’t even talk about free software even if Shinken is one of it, not just open source) : let the technical aspect of the projects talk for us. You’ve got 10 years of developement ahead us. The next years will be quite interesting for the monitoring open source community (because all I try to do is for it after all), isn’t it?
Maybe one day free software and open core will be in the same project who knows? I hope so, and that’s the monitoring community that’s will make it possible.
Jean
Ps: by the way : if I’m not wrong there is no announce of seedcamp in the devel mailing list, maybe it can be good to send one if it’s for the developpers community.
blah, blah, blah,
You heard about the drama on the mailing list but yet you are still busy creating more. If you truly believed that flaming is nonsense then why do you initiate it? It is very humble of you to request the flaming to stop after you have had your inaccurate dramatic statements posted. I suppose you thought your statements would not be challenged because we usually do not respond to ridiculous rantings of a seemingly angry person who jumps to inaccurate conclusions and makes rash assumptions.
Your reason for forking lacks substance. Nagios is an engine. A very powerful engine that has gained in popularity because Ethan Galstad has been a very successful programmer and gatekeeper of the project. If you are not happy with the progress of the project, so what! You are just one person . There are millions of Nagios users that are very happy with the Nagios engine. We do not feel the need to cater to one or a few angry people that are jealous of Ethans success. Your lack of respect for Ethan is appalling, knowing that Ethan spent 10 years of his life developing Nagios and cultivating the community.
You “forkers” try to justify your actions by saying it is for the good of the community. The rest of us know the real reason is to satisfy your own egos (really twisted). You must feel unethical about what you are doing or you would not have tried to blame us for your actions. IMO, you forked because you and Gerhard lack the skills and creativity to start your own project. You would rather “steal” someone else’s work. Further evidence of your lack of creativity is posted on your own website where even your tag line is stolen from Nagios.
It is time to stop the negative, inaccurate, flaming drama directed at Ethan and Nagios. Do your own hard work and stop attacking Ethan and the work that he has done for the last 10 years. Please share my response with your partner in crime, Gerhard Loser.
For the assumptions how can we make something else? There is no activity on the community side. That’s something hard to understand for a open source project.
I couldn’t let the “Lack creativity” part. Do you at least look at Shinken features for the distributed architecture? You think you can say “easy distributed as in cloud marketing slides” without some creativity? For the “stealing” part… no I stop flame, really. But maybe I’m wrong after all, and the community will show us who is right.
For my ego : I try during 6 months to talk about this code in offlist. This project was a proof of concept for Nagios code, even aproposal for inclusion after I saw taht’s it’s better/easier to go on this code than the old one. Beleve me, managing a project, make a website and all is not so funny, and I don’t need it for my ego. I prefer coding. But someone must raise in front of Zabbix and Zenoss in the open source community.
For the “tag line” yes, it’s cop/paste : you know better than everyone else that you are not joking with trademark. you are far better than me in this, so I prefer take enough precausion (by the way you can look at the (r) in nearly every Nagios name in this site).
So we are agree in the stoping flaming, and i’m very agree of it. I know that Ethan work on Nagios for 10years, and I say a big thanks to him. But if I think the community must have a good monitoring tool for the distributed environnements, I don’t see why I won’t propose it, 10 yearsof hard work or not. That’s something hard to understand I know, but that’s how open source always get better tools.
It’s public, so Gerhard will look it. And for the personal attack about it’s name, … no, I won’t give you this satisfaction with a flaming answer, sorry.
Let’s the code came back with freaking new features
Relevant sections quoted above.
You must not be familiar with the open source concept. The idea is that people can take code and improve it, then redistribute it. If someone feels they can make a better version of your product, you should ENCOURAGE them to try, even if you don’t think they can. Yes, it’s sometimes better to try to keep efforts unified in one project instead of branching, but Jean’s idea would REQUIRE a complete change of code for it to remain in the Nagios realm, and that idea has been discarded by the Nagios group (which is perfectly their right).
To say that someone is STEALING the work of open source efforts by recreating its functionality with ANOTHER open source project shows your ignorance and lack of respect for what F/OSS really means.
Many people like Nagios, and it is a very popular platform. It is for this reason Shinken wishes to be compatible with Nagios’ configuration. It’s flattery, it’s practicality, it’s mutually beneficial, and it’s legal.
Mary, you should be embarrassed by your comments, and Nagios, LLC should be ashamed to have you representing their business.
Excellent response Luke .. Could hardly add to that.
Mind you, I just discovered Shinken today while looking up something about GLPI .. From what I have read so far, why would I keep using nagios when I can have Shinken .. Perhaps, this would force nagios to improve its opensource core .. A win win for opensource all around ..
Naparuba, I am impressed with your restraint and humility .. Like you said: let the code do the talking.
Mary Starr, you really ought to be ashamed to be posting trash like that while representing a world visible project like nagios .. yukk !!!
why not:)